Redwall fans?

[artemis-lady-warrior]

No I don't think he said that on the show. I have the show taped and I don't remember him saying that also I don't even remember Cluny shouting. 'WHO DARES CHALLANGE CLUNY THE SCOURGE?!" every few minutes either. XD (In the book)

[Blazemane]

See, I tried to tape that episode too, but i missed/skipped a great deal of it, including what Martin says (or doesn't say) after he comes down the steps with Cornflower.

Here's another thing. I've always just answered by saying Cluny was transfixed by the sheer ominous horror of the bell falling towards him, but a part of me still asks: Why didn't he just run instead of staring at the bell falling towards him and yelling for 5 seconds straight?

[artemis-lady-warrior]

Here's another thing. I've always just answered by saying Cluny was transfixed by the sheer ominous horror of the bell falling towards him, but a part of me still asks: Why didn't he just run instead of staring at the bell falling towards him and yelling for 5 seconds straight?

because when you see things falling toward you your brain goes haywire and the only way to be saved from it is if someone pulls you out of the way. poor Cluny. he musta had a monster of a heachache after that.

you know what I think? Most villains from redwall get trumatized somehow during the story. I think someone should write a fic where all the Redwall villains go and get councilling. that would be hilarious!

[Blazemane]

Oo, wanna write it? With Nyx (and perhaps if he wishes, Dann?)

I'd just have one problem: Most of the villians' traumatizations occur because of visions, (such as in Cluny's case). I, being a Christian, always get frustrated at this and skip those parts in the book. This is mainly because most of these visions are given by Martin:

HE'S DEAD DUDE (I know your a girl, I'm just saying that as a general expression)!

So, I may have some ethical problems about it.

[artemis-lady-warrior]

lol. I'm a christian too but I didn't really think of it that way. I always thought of it was he's an evil creature and had a horrible childhood and thus had bad dreams because of it.
I would write it but I haven't read all the books. There was plenty of strange non christian things in those books, (visions, cursig, drinking achohol and whatnot) but it never really bothered me because I always considered medevil (it's set in medevil times) things to be that way.

Incidently when I first had the book read to me (by my mother) i thought it was boring then I got into it. Starnge though, my mother is a christian as well and she diodn't care either. sure she cencured out the beart and language but that's about it. She didn't even seem to mind the snake and his hipnosis.

[Blazemane]

Hmm, well some of Cluny's dreams (I know because despite trying to avoid it, I still read odds and ends of those parts, and those parts are explained later in the book anyways) did have to do with seeing Matthias coming after him to kill him. That's definetely from Martin in the stories. There are a few other things too. Like... Matthias' name given by Martin. It sounds rather sacreligious. I think you know what I'm referring to, so I'd rather not even write it.

[artemis-lady-warrior]

yeah if you put it that way..........
Cluny wasn't dreaming about matthias though. He was dreaming about martin. He thought Matty was martin. hahahahaa!
Why don't you think of it like Lord of the Rings or Narnia? Maybe it won't seem that weird if you do. Cluny's nightmares are funny. XD

[Nyx]

I Never said I didn't like Lord Brocktree, He's my favourite badger along with Sunflash. I just think that Unggat Trunn deserved something better.

With Cluny's dreams, they seem to be prohetic dreams, ones that show alittle of your future. He must of had them more at Redwall because thats where he first saw Martian's tapastry and the dreams seemed to keep warning him of danger. Maybe someone who was in ghost form, must of loved him enough to try and stop him dieing.

Just a thought.

[Blazemane]

Why don't you think of it like Lord of the Rings or Narnia? Maybe it won't seem that weird if you do. Cluny's nightmares are funny. XD

You just *had* to magically know I like both of those (especially Lord of The Rings). Hmmmm, I guess you have a point, especially considering Redwall isn't a story on Earth really, although it kind of is.

Hmm, intruiging point. I can consider. However, changes of mind don't just happen overnight for me. I am one of the most indesicive creatures on the face of this planet. I'll probably end up holding my opinion. See, somehow, and I can't explain how, Redwall seems different than LOTR and Narnia.

See, because at least with Narnia any visions and supernatural occurences are an allegory of God and Christians and Christianity in general and were meant in no other way by C.S. Lewis.

As for the Lord of the Rings... I don't know... it just seems like... the races there were created with specific powers and as such it doesn't seem evil to even have wizards in it.

But Redwall creatures seem to be exactly intended after their animals on Earth, and thus, Redwallian supernatural events seem to have some evil force behind them.

Not that my opinion outways yours or anything though. I believe it's Romans 14 that talks about with issues like this with diagreements; that if it's right for somebody, it's right for them and their doing nothhing wrong. But for peeps (like me) who have doubts about it, we've got to avoid it.

Man, I wish I could decide things more readily and surely. This fiction does sound like sooooooo much slaggin' fun to write. I can just imagine the warlords talking in soft, vulnerable, pleating voices and kind of sniffling (like Scorponok when he talks about Rhinox to Megatron in Dark Designs).

Thanks for your advice and your input though.

[artemis-lady-warrior]

youre welcome. but remember. Theyre animals and don't really have souls. It might not mean anything but Brian never really specified where the animals live or anything 9Though he does mention portugal) i'm not saying you have to change your mind I was just making a suggestion. But if you feel that way why do you read the books if you think those things are evil? I'm not judging you. I'm just asking.

loll. I can imagine cluny being like..
"I got swuashed by a bell in the Prime of my life. I haven't walked straight since."

lol

[Blazemane]

But if you feel that way why do you read the books if you think those things are evil? I'm not judging you. I'm just asking.

I understand, and I've asked myself that. My answer to you (and me) is that: the parts that I consider possibly wrong, I skip (which at some level, I've admitted earlier, I have failed. Still, generally I do skip those parts). The rest of the book ought to be just fine if I'm not reading those parts.

Although, I suppose there is a point in saying: if any element is bad the whole thing is bad. But, in my opinion, the rest really can be fine. Is there anything wrong about reading about a long-tailed rat and a novice mouse going at it wtih swords? No. Is there anything wrong with a dead warrior from the past freaking the said rat with visions about a deadly future? See that's where I get scared and say: perhaps.

Besides, it's not like other books where these things are heavily concentrated and could never be avoided. In Redwall, the center of the story is not these parts. It's about warlords and villains threatening freedom of good creatures.

Now, there is I think one exception: The Bellmaker. I was apprehensive at first about reading it because the whole plot *is* based on a mouse's vision. However, I talked to some Christian friends at my school who had read the book, and said, that yes, the setup was that vision, but after that, it means nothing to the plot. After that, and a little debating with myself, I finally read it, and basically was ok with it. Now, I read what I've written about it, and kind of get nervous again, but I was ok when i read it, and the prevelant belief in my mind is that it's still ok.

Sorry if a random rant about The Bellmaker is... random, but the point was to try not to contradict myself when I said "The center of the story is not these parts (the visions, etc.). At any rate, if there is any fault in my reasoning or contradiction in it, *please* point it out. I know your not judging me.

And I want to stress: I am not, repeat: not judging you either. I'm merely expressing my personal apprehensions. And again, thank you for talking to me about this. It's best for me to talk about this to other people, to see if I'm doing anything wrong.

[artemis-lady-warrior]

well if you see it that way the... oklay. you don't really have to read those parts to understand the story (in redwall at least) the Bellmaker sounds boring anyway so i'll probably never read and and will thus avoid that kind of problem)

I do know that in Lord Brocktree the badger and the Wildcat both dream about each other and finally meeting. (I only read it once so my memory is a bit fuzzy) so did you skip those parts too? just asking not judging. I kinda skipped those parts as well cuz they didn't seem to have anything to do with the story aside form the hero and villain waking up in bad moods.

[Blazemane]

Yeah, I did skip those parts.

[artemis-lady-warrior]

yeah i figured. They weren't that great anyway. XD

[VelociBerg]

I liked Redwall and Lord Brocktree the best so far out of the ones I've read.